Who else could lift Thor's Hammer?
Posted by Epyon
This forum is currently read only. You can not log in or make any changes. This is a temporary situation.
And let me repeat for Epyon. He is not really concerned with the RPG rules. That being said I really disagree with the Colossus arguements. Granted I have never seen him go beserk and had no idea that he had killed or what he did to Wisdom, but I still think he is worthy. I don't think it's fair to hold temporary acts of insanity against him, I'm sure that Thor hasn't always been in his right mind. And what happened to Colossus being portrayed as the gentle giant, did I miss something? How many times has Thing gone off half @#$%&? I don't think he's any more worthy than Colossus. Also remember that half the time in X-men comics one group of writers leave and don't bother to tie up loose ends. Then the next group comes along and not wanting to deal with them completely ignores them and does their own thing. Again I cite the mutant Cable (complete with technorganic virus instead of cybernetics) as an example of this. Compaired to some Marvel comics the X-men is an ugly patchwork quilt of ideas.
But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong. Alabar
All right forget the rules (kinda silly IMO as that is what we talk about here, but anyway). Neither Thing or Colossus are anywhere near close to worthy. It took someone like Beta Ray Bill (savior and champion of his entire race) to match the worth of the Odinson. In other words you have to be on par with the valor, might and altruism of Thor to be worthy. Thing's preoccupation with his looks and self loathing alone would disqualify him. Add to that the anger and he's light years away (and no anger alone will not dsqualify someone as Thor himself is known to blow his top). And Colossus is along the same lines as far as temper goes and he has even gone so far as joining the bad guys of his own free will. If he hadn't of died in the process, releasing the cure to the legacy virus MIGHT have atoned for much of this, not all but much. BUT even that was a byproduct of his grief and anger at his sisters loss. If she hadn't have died would he have been so quick to sacrifice himself? Now Thor has no family on Earth and yet has spent centuries defending and protecting these people out of a sense of pure nobility and altruism. And it is because of that fact that almost no one in the Marvel universe is worthy.
Hmmmmm? I wonder if that could have something to do with the extreme restrictions put on the mallet in game terms? Oh that's right we aren't discussing rules. DG X( Marvel > DC
I have a question. If you prove worthy to wield it once, can you wield it from then on even if you do something bad? I know everyone will jump and say "Of course you can no longer wield it!", but there is precedent. Thor went mad remember. He fought the Silver Surfer and Beta Ray Bill. He honestly was trying killing them and yet the hammer still obeyed.
As a sidenote, I believe that worthiness should be viewed from the point of view of a Viking 1200 years ago. Valor, might, and even honor I can see being part of worth. Altruism and self-sacrifice though? Hmm...these might not be as requisite as we, 21st century people, would reflexively propose. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a night. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm the rest of his life
Interesting points by all. You are right to point out that Thor has been out of his gourd on occasion, yet was still able to lift the hammer. I think it would be fascinating for Marvel to do a story where Thor did something to make himself unworthy of Mjolnir, and he had to do something to redeem himself.
As for other Marvel heroes, I suppose we could all argue endlessly for and and against particular individuals being able to lift Mjolnir. I think it's just an interesting issue to think about, because Marvel has gone out of its way to severely limit the number of heroes who are worthy of the hammer. BTW, the reason I was not really considering the rules of the RPG is that I don't think they are accurate. There really is no basis in the comics to believe that the hammer weighs a ton (remember, both Captain America and a frog lifted it). Odin's enchantment focused on the worthiness of the holder, not the wielder's physical strength.
I'm I seriously doubt Spiderman is the savior of his race. I don't think that's an official qualification.
The rules were made for the game so players wouldn't be running around w/ Thor's hammer. Writer's of comics would not have this probelm. Colossus started getting weird after the Mutant massacre and never really quite recovered. Remember when he was a selfish New York jerk artist? Before that I'd easily say he could do it. Also, why is the inscription on thor's hammer in English?
Please don't mention things like Spiderman lifiting Thor's hammer or Hulk lifting mountains. We all know how silly the comics can be.
And once again Thor is not subject to the limitation on the mallet. The limitation is for those who aren't Thor trying to lift it. I know they didn't put the clause, disregard if your dad is a Skyfather and your mom is an Elder God, but I think we can all assume that is the case. Thor didn't have to prove his worth to wield it, he simply had to prove to his dad he was mature enough to do so. THE RESTRICTION DOES NOT APPLY TO THOR. And also let me restate the strength limitation is BEACUSE THE HAMMER WEIGHS ALOT. Physcially it is a heavy object. It always has been even in legend. In D&D Thor's Hammer weighs over 2 tons. As for the rules, they have to be strict as the hammer itself says you must be on par with Thor to wield it. The idea that anyone with less than 1000 karma and good (not the rank) popularity can wield it is what's silly to me. And as a side note I always love what people choose to be offended by. A story of a Norse god come to earth, fighting along side mutants and genetically engineered soldiers (Cap) and the carzy part is the way he talks? You can accept the fact that he is a living God, he flys by throwing his hammer and holding on, he can summon lightning, he can spin his hammer to open dimesnional portals and yet you can't get over the fact that he says thee and thou? Suspension of disbeleif doesn't apply to vocal patterns? DG X( Marvel > DC
Viking/Norse Code of Honor (from GURPS: Vikings -- say what you want about the game, the sourcebooks kick @#$%&)
A Viking must be courageous without being foolhardy, tenacious, cheerful, true to his word at all times, hospitable, open-handed and loyal. He must avenge a wrong or an insult, protect his friends and family, live well and die well. Men must tell and retell his saga over their ale until the end of time. Cleverness and luck are also admired, though cleverness can be as much a vice as a virtue. Luck is a gift rather than a positive character trait, but none the less admirable for that. The true viking hero is honest, hospitable, courageous, and loyal, a deadly fighter, a cunning poet, and epic feaster and dreaker, and sometimes a magician as well. and for a VERY detailed look at Mjolnir's inscription & it's ramifications -- [www.freetech.org] --------------------- Be Ex/20 to one another!
|
