Surfer vs Thor

Something I never really considered till recently was hulks healing factor. Though it really is true he heals pretty fast and keeps on coming.

Peter David, I believe, is the Hulk scribe who came up with the Hulk's regenerative powers. But it wasn't "new" in the sense that the Hulk developed a new power. According to David, the Hulk has always had superhuman regenerative powers--but usually the Hulk healed so fast, observers assumed the Hulk hadn't even been injured. The way I see it, you can either give the Hulk Monstrous body armor, or Amazing body armor plus Unearthly regeneration. I have gone with the latter.

Hulks a tough brute, and one of Marvel's top powerhouses. I'd say that at peak strength he is easily the strongest character on Marvel Earth and perhpas the strongest non-entity in the entire MU.

Thor's draw back when it comes to fighting Hulk is his concern for Banner, and his reluctance to just "give'em Hell". There is ALWAYS at point in which Thor says something to the effect that he will have to begin to use his full strength to beat the "Green Troll", but of course, by that point in the battle Thor HAS TO take the gloves off just to keep up.

Now, if Thor went in intent on onething alone, ending the Hulk, I seriously doubt that the Hulk would survive long enough to benenfit from any adreniline rush.

So, Thor's only drawback is his compassion. Put that aside, and Hulk get Smashed. BIG time.

The belt of strength adds +1 cs str. not double his str. Also when the belt came to play in comics thor was listed as having monst. str. I still think that in game play thor will win against hulk.

I would give the hulk monst. body armour and unearthly regeneration.

Well, the belt doubles Thor's strength in the comics.

If you want to translate that into Shift X strength in game play, that is your prerogative...

I've always given the hulk Incredible level true invulnerability with a rise to Am when mad as well as a two level healing factor, figuring that he healed better and took less damage when nuclear, but that is just my way.

I based it off the secret wars (dont hate me) when he was smarter and not prone to anger he actually healed slow enough to need a cast he was also damaged more than I ever really saw him up until the onslaught thingy

This was discussed in an issue of Wizard where they sat down and worked out who they thought were the 10 toughest superheroes, why they thought it and the results of each fight and why the person that won, won. It was Silver Surfer beating Thor for top spot.

I cannot remember exactly why, but I have the issue and can post it if requested.

I am not really a fan of either of them, but have nothing against them either. The Wizard results seemed well thought out and unbiased and as such I would agree with them and give the victory to Silver Surfer.

For those that never saw the issue, the top four were:
1. Silver Surfer
2. Thor
3. Superman
4. Wonder Woman

I cannot remember the exact order of the rest but let me know and I can look it up and post it. They ranked the coolest fight on the list as being Wonder Woman vs Thor, with Thor winning eventually.

Keep in mind this was a couple of years ago and the characters powers have probably changed as they tend to do in comics.

Wizard also mentioned that Silver Surfer would be able to pick up Mjolnir, if Captain America and Beta Ray Bill can than I see no reason why Silver Surfer could not.

I've quoted that same article in many forums, but the Surfer has never bested Thor in any of their REAL comic bouts and that is more practical evidence as opposed to Wizard's reasoning.

I do agree with them, however, as I see Silver Surfer ultimately more flexible than any other character with powers that have not yet been tested to have a limit.

I do not neccesarily agree with you that since it has not happened in the comics, it cannot happen.

Wizard looked at it from an impartial view point and considered all the facts. The truth of comics is that a fight outcomes are based on what the writer wants as opposed to what actually makes sense.

The general rule that I have found is that whoever's comic it is wins.

I am by no means an expert and there is nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree.

CrawlerFan99 Wrote:
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> I've quoted that same article in many forums, but
> the Surfer has never bested Thor in any of their
> REAL comic bouts and that is more practical
> evidence as opposed to Wizard's reasoning.
>
> I do agree with them, however, as I see Silver
> Surfer ultimately more flexible than any other
> character with powers that have not yet been
> tested to have a limit.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2006 07:01PM by Dragonblade.

So then you agree with me... when speaking of "evidence," it is usually what is thrown back at me when I cite this article.

I believe that I'm agreeing with you. But it is Friday and am easily confused.

Maybe what someone should do is get a GM and two players have a go at it in the Marvel system and see who comes out on top.

That isn't always the best measure, as the two players may have drastically different levels of tactical aptitude.

Case-in-point, I once beat the Beetle (controlled by my less tactically inclined buddy) using Mockingbird. On paper it seemed like a sure bet for him, with Mockingbird having no way, shape or form of damaging the Beetle. On paper.

As we played the battle out on the city map however, I quickly manuevered Mockingbird off the streets and into a tall building, ie. took away the advantge of flight and thus speed. She then hid for a bit. Tried a bit of hit-and-run, and then finally lured the over-confident lout into an elevator shaft and brought the elevator down on him. That didn't hurt the Beetle much, but as he freed himself from the wreckage, the counter-weight came plummetting down from several stories up. Game over.

On paper Thor and Silver Surfer come out fairly even... with Surfer having speed and enormous energy attacks at his disposal, and Thor having enough control of the winds and weather to counter Surfer's speedy flight coupled with unrivalled and absolutely devasting close combat skills.

So, if Surfer can keep things at a distance the odds move into his favour. If he can't, and it's hardly a forgone conclusion that he can, those odds dwindle drastically.

In terms of tactical aptitude, the advantage goes to Thor by a longshot. And that goes quintiple with Mjolnir in hand.

As for the Surfer's versatility... true. His powers are potentially much more versatile. Potentially. Thor however has been using his powers, which go far beyond Magneto's or Storm's, for centuries or even millenia, and uses what he has (which is alot) to it's utmost potential. Surfer has only been using his for a few decades at most.

In fact, Thor and/or Thor's hammer has powers of healing and wholeness that writers haven't even tapped yet.

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Powersurge (history, pics) [www.classicmarvel.com]

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Morningstar (campaign journal) [www.classicmarvel.com]

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"You just decided *all by yourselves* that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and *only* you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process..."

T'Challa, The New Avengers: Illuminati 1

Thor's hammer could technically be a moot point as although there is no evidence to suggest it is possible, there is also no evidence to show that it is not possible for surfer to take hold of Mjolnir.

At most these hypothetical questions are moot.

When I suggested using two players, I should have also specified that the players be of similar proficiency and temperment.

Powersurge, I forget where it was mentioned (I'll have to look for it) but in one comic I have, it mentions that the Surfer had been Galactus' herald for centuries. Remember, Zenn Lavian's have lifespans in the thousands of years, so you can't go by "apparent age" when looking at Shalla Bal, for instance.

Another interesting point to Silver Surfer #4, where the Surfer conceeds that Thor is more powerful, is that, in the issue before that, the Surfer also admits that he was "less than what he once was." Some feel that the Surfer was less powerful while being trapped on earth, not being able to so directly absorb cosmic energy. Granted there are only hint's and theories regarding this, but it's a possibility.

I remember when Tyrant captured the Surfer, Gladiator, Terrax, BETA RAY BILL, among a few others, and after monitoring their powers, stated that the Surfer was the most powerful of all those present. Granted it's a no-brainer that the Surfer is more powerful than Thor and Bill when not factoring in the variable of their hammer's, just saying...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/16/2006 12:50PM by Robert.

CrawlerFan99 Wrote:
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> I could not agree more. I believe that Thor wins
> the battles mostly because he is usually the
> protagonist in their meets. If they would go at
> eachother at full power, I think that the power
> cosmic would prove more powerful than Mjolnir.
>
> I admit that Thor is the better fighter, but
> Surfer's powers are ever expanding as he still
> discovers what he can and cannot do.
>
> There was even a comic where Surfer kept the
> hammer from Thor as he threw it by encasing it in
> a force field. Of course, the 60 second rule no
> longer applies, but the Surfer can probably drop
> the hammer in another dimension and face Thor
> without it... just my thoughts.
>
> BTW I love both Thor and Surfer equally, I just
> feel that Surfer "should" be the more powerful one
> of the two.

I lik eboth of them too. YOu cannot ignore that galactus ran from a fight with thor. A hungry galactus would never run from a fight with the surfer now would he? lol

it is more of a popularitu contest then who is stronger. if bugs bunny fought thanos. he would win. the hulk is a buigger product. thor can dent solid admantium the only one to evenhold back a strike of his hammer.
hulk cannot break admantium nor dent it.

Thats a terrible comparisson. As pointed out on this board several times galactus has the ability to remove the surfers powers, seeing how he granted them. Could you please tell me where and when galactus ran from thor? I don't see that happening.
As to who's more powerfull I believe with the surfers new understanding of his powers{since he left earth through the barrier} And he got way more powerfull { I add one more rank to all stats and powers} I think this fight is way closer than most people think. But thors huge fighting rank is probably the differance again. It's awfully hard to beat someone with shift y fighting.

muthal the cursed Wrote:
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> Thats a terrible comparisson. As pointed out on
> this board several times galactus has the ability
> to remove the surfers powers, seeing how he
> granted them. Could you please tell me where and
> when galactus ran from thor? I don't see that
> happening.
> As to who's more powerfull I believe with the
> surfers new understanding of his powers{since he
> left earth through the barrier} And he got way
> more powerfull { I add one more rank to all stats
> and powers} I think this fight is way closer than
> most people think. But thors huge fighting rank is
> probably the differance again. It's awfully hard
> to beat someone with shift y fighting.


he used one of his god moves. it was in a hulk issue. i don't have it anymore. galactus ran. you can google it up.

4 words....line of sight range.