Is Dr Strange being toned down too much?

New Avengers #27, 28, 29, and 30

I have most of those. I'm just missing one. I'm guessing it happened in that issue. :-/

I think it's specifically in #28 or 29, but I don't have my comics here to double check.

And I can't find it anywhere in town... I may have to get it via Milehigh.com. Ah well. Thanks.

So that being said I dont think that have depowered him and made him weak. I think that have just brought him back to where he is supposed to be. WHile other writers used him as a plot device in the past which made him TOO powerful. Now he seems to be about right.

I still think there have been instances where he's seemed gimped. Like stating his inability to time travel when in past comic issues he regularly traveled back in time... even maintained a friendship with Ben Franklin. And the Cloak of Levitation (which is actually a cloak of flight) not being able to be used to fly was still not explained to my satisfaction. It's described as being effortless to use. I accept his weakened state as to why he couldn't help with the plane crashing, but the Cloak and the time travel examples still need to be explained.

It's all that pesky continuity that the new writers don't want to keep up with, even when like you've pointed out Dr. Strange practically vacations in the past (he had Clea along with him I think in the last appearance I saw of him in the past, during that travel into the past by the West Coast Avengers). We also got a reminder in that same storyarc that Strange went back in time and was a hidden, instrumental part of the FF escaping from and later driving off Rama-Tut in ancient Egypt. You really have to wonder who's doing the bios on these characters and if the newer writers even bother to read them.

"A shared universe, like any fictional construct, hinges on suspension of disbelief. When continuity is tossed away, it tatters the construct. Undermines it."

-- Peter David

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It's been long standing policy that travelling in the past changes nothing of the present as a divergent timeline will be created and the events of the current timeline will ultimately remain unaffected.

This has been Marvel's story and they've been sticking to it nearly, oh, 30 years now. Instead of doing a paragraph's worth of dialogue to rehash this concept again, when asked if Strange can simply go in the past and fix everything, Strange simply replied No. And that's really the truth as time travel would do zilch to fix any problems the Avengers currently have.

You should just stop buying comics, because apparently nothing good has been written since the end of Secret Wars 2. I don't see the point in sticking with a product that you've so clearly hated for the last 15 - 20 years of your association with it.

Didn't he actually state that he can't go to the past at all, though?

I'd have to reread the issue to be sure.

Well if you're right and he simply stated he can't use time travel to "fix" everything, then I'll retract my questioning of that bit... but if he's saying he can't time travel at all, I still call bull.

If I'm remembering the sequence right [and i might not be] I remember Spider-Man was firing off some 'can you do this...' type stuff at strange, it was more of a back and forth dialogue type thing without Strange giving much of an explanation. Like 'Can you go back in time and stop x from happening' and strang was simply, 'no'. I seem to remember Spidey following it up if Strange could transport them all to Japan.

But that said, I don't think i've read anywhere in recent memory Strange saying he couldn't time travel period. But then again, those newfangle Mystic Arcana books are coming out, and they're supposed to redifine magic in the marvel U, so who knows.

Well it's understandable if Strange said he couldn't go back into time to change an event, given his knowledge he should be more than aware of the nature of time that he'd only get shunted into a parallel reality or create a divergent timeline. Only a rare few beings possess the power or technology to actually interfere with their own timeline and/or avoid creating divergent realities (Immortus being the most likely known person). Kang on the other hand seems to thrive on creating divergent versions of himself (for the ones who know enough about time travel to realize time creates divergent realities, some have shown an appalling lack of temporal theory for all that they boast about being master of time).

Generally in Marvel if a character or characters seem to interact with their own actual past they only do so because of a predestination paradox, where what they do actually causes and maintains a stable loop in time, as the events they go back to interfere with actually ensure the events that caused them to go back in the first place.

"A shared universe, like any fictional construct, hinges on suspension of disbelief. When continuity is tossed away, it tatters the construct. Undermines it."

-- Peter David

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[www.classicmarvel.com] - There is no such thing as too powerful Forum Thread

Nightmask Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well it's understandable if Strange said he
> couldn't go back into time to change an event,
> given his knowledge he should be more than aware
> of the nature of time that he'd only get shunted
> into a parallel reality or create a divergent
> timeline. Only a rare few beings possess the
> power or technology to actually interfere with
> their own timeline and/or avoid creating divergent
> realities (Immortus being the most likely known
> person). Kang on the other hand seems to thrive
> on creating divergent versions of himself (for the
> ones who know enough about time travel to realize
> time creates divergent realities, some have shown
> an appalling lack of temporal theory for all that
> they boast about being master of time).
>
> Generally in Marvel if a character or characters
> seem to interact with their own actual past they
> only do so because of a predestination paradox,
> where what they do actually causes and maintains a
> stable loop in time, as the events they go back to
> interfere with actually ensure the events that
> caused them to go back in the first place.

It's disgusting, but once again you state the absolute truth! In the case of 'time travel' and the Marvel U., the stable loop is exactly what they intended all along and is undoubtedly the most logical/rational theory! Lol! This is so off topic?!?8-)

capocastillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You should just stop buying comics, because
> apparently nothing good has been written since the
> end of Secret Wars 2. I don't see the point in
> sticking with a product that you've so clearly
> hated for the last 15 - 20 years of your
> association with it.

Well Capo, don't misunderstand me. But this sounds like the whole "America; love it or leave it!" That statement is trash, it goes too far. As if the only choice to deal with something is to accept/like it or give it up?! When your car breaks down do you buy a new one each time, or how about when it needs an oil change?!8-) Some people think, and I happen to be one:D, that the Marvel U. needs an enema of continuity::!o! That (continuity)is exactly what made it unique from all other forms of fiction. It is no longer like this and people can choose to be loyal and yet demand that it change. That's how the constitution got amendments!

Now if only there were an easy route to give feedback and file complaints about the growing problems, but I've been having zero luck finding any ways to submit complaints to any kind of appropriate dept. Heck I hadn't noticed it before but it seems like a lot of titles don't even have a letters page anymore, and I'm not going to send in a complaint to the Hulk title that still has one for disagreements over the trashing of continuity with the Illuminati and other titles.

"A shared universe, like any fictional construct, hinges on suspension of disbelief. When continuity is tossed away, it tatters the construct. Undermines it."

-- Peter David

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Why thanks, that's much appreciated.

"A shared universe, like any fictional construct, hinges on suspension of disbelief. When continuity is tossed away, it tatters the construct. Undermines it."

-- Peter David

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Nightmask Character Sheet

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[www.classicmarvel.com] - Complete list of my characters various forum URLs, over 30 to enjoy!

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Godiva Character Sheet

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[www.furaffinity.net] Art by Marvel Comic's artist Rusty Haller!

[www.furaffinity.net] Artist/writer/Creator of The Extinctioners Independent super-hero comic!

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Sappho Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Cornucopia Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Nightmares of Futures Past Ongoing Story

[www.classicmarvel.com] - There is no such thing as too powerful Forum Thread

Comics and the constitution are hardly the same thing.

Comics are a hobby. And if someone doesn't like a hoby, what sense does it make to spend good money on the hobby when all it does is serve to piss you off and make you complain? The way to truly make your voice heard is to /take the money away/. If you buy a car and it constantly breaks down, would you buy the same type of car? If you keep putting good money down on repairs and it still keeps @#$%& up, would you get a different car? Sure.

But what won't change anything is giving a company money when they don't give you what you want. If you give them your money, that's /tacit support/ of the product you purchased. The only thing that will cause a change in the product is if the product makes less money than it did before.

And as the comment in question was directed at nightmask, the fact of the matter is, any topic comes up about Marvel's current comics, the same complaints always come up. And if you really don't like it anymore, it's dumb to stay involved in it. No less keep spending money on it. That money can go towards hobbies that actually produce some enjoyment.