The Punisher

Who was his sidekick that made all the weapons?

Microchip

Well since this post came up. Since the Punisher actually kills people, How does he get Karma. My friend wants to play a Punisher type but thinks that it is jacked that you lose all Karma. He claims that Hit men today do get better and more skilled but in Game that is not possible with the Lose all Karma rule any advice?

I believe the punisher gets Negative Karma, just like a criminal. But if you ever 'team up' with him, your character had better of the same template karma wise. Otherwise, your four color hero will lose all karma when the Punisher kills someone.

Least, that's how I think of the question at hand.

Brelas

The Marvel Comic Book characters tend to operate under special rules not available to player characters (at least, not without substantial judge discretion). I call these special rules "weasel clauses", since they invariably exempt the listed hero from specific karma penalties.

For instance, in the Advanced Rule Book the Mind Control power had the PC losing karma (5 or 10 points) every time the power was used since it was the equivelant of "breaking and entering", or some such thing. However, all the heroes listed in the Marvel Handbooks that had the Mind Control power as thier primary power always had a "weasel clause" in thier descriptions that negated that karma penalty. "Karma grew up in a crappy environment and needed to use her Mind Control powers to survive. Since she doesn't see anything wrong with Mind Controlling people, she loses no karma when using Mind Control on others."

Several of the Old West heroes, such as the Two Gun Kid had special karma rules stating that it was okay to kill villains as long as it was during an open, stand up fight. This special karma rule was presumably based on the common values and views of right and wrong during the Old West that TGK grew up in.

The Punisher presumably has a weasel clause or two as well. At the very least, karma advancement pools would probably not be harmed by killing crooks (innocents, yes, but not criminals). The Punisher may not lose karma for killing criminals who are trying to kill him or innocents, as well.

Actual hit men count as villains in the game, and as such they get karma for committing crimes. The Punisher counts as an anti-hero, and still operates more or less in the good guy interpretation of the Karma rules.

Shima1975 Wrote:
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>How does he get Karma.

Same as everyone else. If he is a Hero (positive Popularity) he can get Karma like any other hero. If he is a Villian (negative Popularity) he can get Karma for killing just like a Villian (AMSHJ, p. 20).

> My friend wants to play a Punisher type but thinks
> that it is jacked that you lose all Karma. He
> claims that Hit men today do get better and more
> skilled but in Game that is not possible with the
> Lose all Karma rule any advice?

He's completely and totally wrong.

You can get Karma as either a hero or a villian, all you need to do is spend it *between* killings. This means that you will advance more slowly and you are unlikely to be able to save up for *big* Karma expenditures, but it's still possible.

If you kill indescriminately and frequently then either as hero or a villian you will stay pretty much the same. As it should be. Someone who kills at whim WILL have a harder time all the way around, as it should be.

Killing lots of people also does an interesting thing in the game besides getting rid of your Karma:

A: Brings the wrath of the law. Cops and district attornies will view your character as a murderer, because he is. The Punisher in crime terms has committed about 2,500 to 3,000 murders...which is totally insane since the most hostile real-life serial killer has probably only killed in the 250 range (this is very open to debate but very hard to proove and probably not so good a topic for this board since there are kids on here). My point, Frank is a much more wanted man than any of the criminals he is hunting these days, even if 2/3rds of his body count is self defense, which is unlikely since he is hunting the villians. You mow down all the bad guys, you will be viewed as a bad guy.



B: Brings the wrath of players who have taken the code against killing. The Punisher is never going to be an Avenger (outside of a What If? comic). The fact that Captain America has not hunted him down is a lapse in the Marvel Universe continuety in my eyes, since Frank is a much more dangerious killer than a mysterious group of guys in the skull masks shouting "Justice is served!" and blasting minor super villians. Fool Killer is never going to team up with a bunch of civic minded hero people in Manhattan and take down the mob (although he did get his own limited edition), so if you "off" to many bad guys, you will be viewed as a bad guy and hunted down by the characters who see themselves as good guys.

My character has planted several villians over the years....as has Thor, Batman and even Captain America, sometimes it is part of the job BUT it is NOT the job...then you are just a psycho.
This doesn't mean he can't be the team loose cannon. Get all crazy and nearly go too far every once in a while.
Besides, if he kills the badguys off, how in the world will he be able to foster the burning, seething hatred that takes decades and makes great enemies?