A secert Wars question!

Does everyone remember the excellent Secret Wars mini series from marvel in the early to mid 80's?

I've always felt that the forces of good were greater in number and too powerful for the forces of evil to win.

Was it designed that way un-purpose by Marvel comics?

That was an awesome mini-series. One of my first true comicbook memories, ie. what prompted me to begin buying, reading, hording them consistently.

I don't recall if the forces were lop-sided. I do remeber Dr.Doom stoled the Beyonders power. Holy #$%@!!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2006 02:48PM by Powersurge.

Any time Doom is on a side, that side has a lop-sided advantage. Why he doesnt already rule the world, couldnt tell you.

Boredom. He's aken over the world three times so far, and once gave it up b/c it was boring with no one to challenge him.

Well then, there ARE intergalactic empires out there. If Doom's bored with world domination he can always launch an invasion of the Shi'ar Empire or something.

Wouldn't that be an intersting role-reversal? Earthlings as the alien invaders bent on domination?

Dr. Doom and Mr. Fantastic are near even on smarts. Doom on one team doesn't tip the scales by himself.

The way I see it, the heros outnumber the villians, thus it wasn't a fair fight.

I don't think has the leadership abilities to stage an attack on other races. What people of Earth would follow him on such a quest. Too much pride. That's why he always alone. he won't rely on others much less trust them.

If he knew how to utilize he powers more effectively, couldn't the Molecule Man had taken down all of the heroes one at a time?

Doom lost the beyonder power cause he couldn't it. Molecule Man wasn't really evil just confused. His power levels are based on his emotion level. In the Secret Wars 2 it was thru him that Silver Surfer was able to repair the Rockies. Good overpowered evil because the bad guys don't play together real well.

:.D Awsome series loved the Beyonder hated to see him depowered the way he was very wrong I liked the concept of what he was if you remember he slapped down Galactus.I think that was because he Invaded the realm of the Beyonders themselves.:!)-D

Well you have to consider the magnitude of characters on the villains' side. Ultron, Molecule Man, Doom, Galactus.

The beings gathered on the villain ship were far more impressive on power level than the Heroes, even if the heroes had Magneto.

Just because the battle got more factionalized later is irrelevant to the Beyonder's original scheme.

Galactus in secret wars was his own force he was not allied with the villans at all.The villans had as much a problem with Galactus as the Heroes did.Ultron wanted to kill everyone untill Galactus sucked his power from him,AND THE MOLUCULE MAN really didnt want to fight in the beganing at All.Dr Doom well always self serving villan great bad guy.

The Beyonder knew what he was doing. Some people he was likely on the fence post about though like Molecule Man and Magneto. The latter was a defender of mutant-kind which likely meant hero to the One from Beyond.

Damn that was a fun series.

Beyonder was later retcon'd into an incomplete cosmic cube. Or was that what he WANTED people to think?

Well it was an awful retcon to say the least, one that negatively impacted a lot of other continuity, and one I'd thought was the worst Marvel had ever done until the One More Day retcon inflicted upon Spider-man to erase and destroy 20+ years of continuity and history.

Even with that retcon though there's nothing to say he wasn't still infinitely powerful, particularly after the events of the Infinity Crusades noted that properly formed cosmic cubes have built in limiters to how much they can do (a limit never previously noticed) so one improperly formed not having any limiters would still be infinity powerful. Still bad writing though done by executive fiat demanding the Beyonder be written out by new management that hated what the previous management had done, namely the Beyonder and the Secret Wars.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/02/2008 02:45PM by Nightmask.

On one hand, Secret Wars was the coolest thing ever. On the other, it highlighted the fact that Marvel doesn't do very well with its B-List villainy. Sure, they can wheel out Magneto, Doom, Ultron, Big G...but second-tier villains have always been a bit less developed and worth mention.

The notable exception is Spider-Man's villains, who I think are great examples of B-Listers--Electro, Scorpion, Mysterio, Chameleon, Kraven, among others. They're dangerous for the scale of Spidey stories, and they have cool motivations and interesting back stories.

Where many comics fall flat, I think, is that the antagonist isn't really developed anymore. They're just an excuse for the hero to flash powers and leave him beaten senseless.

One of the lessons they should learn from the movies or successful TV shows like Smallville, where without those well-developed villains (even the ones that are just one-shots) the shows and movies would fail. But too often they just don't do the development that'll make the character shine because of the thought it's just a throwaway character to let the hero(es) show off those powers.

I think if the Secret Wars hadn't had such a limited title run they could have done a better job of characterization on the villains; 9 issues is difficult to express such a grand battle. Of course just having Galactus in the battle alone demonstrated how infinitely powerful the Beyonder was in his ability to draft him so easily but couldn't really demonstrate Galactus even at his real power levels so couldn't really demonstrate many of the other villains or some of the heroes either power-wise or personality-wise.

Probably one of the out-of-character things for the Secret Wars (at least before the character decay many heroes have suffered in the 2000+ era) was Professor X mind-wiping Spider-man just to cover up the X-men leaving to form a separate group. What, did he think all those heroes he'd fought beside in the past were just going to promptly attacking them for looking to leave? Very uncharacteristic. Some of the villain picks were odd too, more than a few seemed more chosen with Spider-man in mind than a more epic good versus evil battle.

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-- Peter David

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Nightmask, Secret Wars was 12 issues....I think. In hind sight, 24 issues would have been much better. I do think the scales were balanced toward the hero's in sheer number.

I really enjoyed Secret Wars II more than the original Secret Wars. I always kind of thought that the villain selection in the original Secret Wars was a little bit on the lame side (with a few exceptions). I really wish Marvel would put out a Secret Wars II Graphic Novel.

What ever became of the Evolutionary War storyline ?!? They promoted the snot out of it back then, and then it just fizzled and dissapeared.

Hmmmm, was it SW2 that had only 9 issues then? Been quite a while since I've gotten to read either unfortunately.

It could have been better with a longer run so they could have explored more of the possibilities, instead of feeling rushed since with everything going on 12 issues was just too short to give the full expression of the epic nature of the battle.

"A shared universe, like any fictional construct, hinges on suspension of disbelief. When continuity is tossed away, it tatters the construct. Undermines it."

-- Peter David

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Nightmask Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Paragon Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Complete list of my characters various forum URLs, over 30 to enjoy!

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Godiva Character Sheet

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[www.furaffinity.net] Artist/writer/Creator of The Extinctioners Independent super-hero comic!

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Sappho Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Cornucopia Character Sheet

[www.classicmarvel.com] - Nightmares of Futures Past Ongoing Story

[www.classicmarvel.com] - There is no such thing as too powerful Forum Thread



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2008 11:27AM by Nightmask.