Magic

I'm curious why the actual ranks of spells that magic users are listed as being able to cast seem so low. The most powerful heroic caster is Dr. Strange, but his spells are pretty much limited to Amazing? Max Amazing eldritch blast? Max Amazing deflection shield? I dunno, I kind of expected his spells to be working at least at Unearthly, considering the amount of power he's got in the comics. I've seen him deflect Class 1000 range blasts in the comics, but based on his listed stats, Cyclops would shatter the (relatively) weak shield Strange vainly manifested and damage the good doctor. Why are the magic users so limited in their stats? Is it an attempt to create game balance for the RPG? If so, it attempts to balance out a magician's extraordinary versatility by tearing their raw power up and spitting it out. Does someone have an explanation that makes any sense?

Probably not, although Strange would likely use a Shield-Multiple spell in order to handle those more powerful attacks, or a dimensional entreaty, since those are generally based on Psyche, so would function at Unearthly or Shift X levels.

Nightmask makes a strong point, the spells listed on Strange's sheet may not seem much, but when you start cracking open the Realms of Magic, all of the sudden, Strange can start doing insane stuff when he starts getting his dimensional contacts involved, or casting very specific forms of spells.

That said, even if someone may have Strange beat on the raw power level, noone can match Strange for diversity. Any single power you can find in the players or Judge's book, all functioning at the Amazing level. And that's if he doesn't start doing things to get some positive column shifts.

Also, remember, magical attacks ignore body armor [but not force fields], which makes him very dangerous indeed.

Well a purely physical attack, like the impact version of a eldrich beam/bolt is generally affected by body armor, particularly natural body armor, but yes most of the time magical attacks treat the target like any other normal human. Which is why it was relatively easy for Dr. Strange to restrain the Hulk after he was mentally damaged by Nightmare (at least until he sacrificed himself in his own mind and left the Hulk mindless for months).

Of course that means that yes even at what sound like lower power levels he's extremely powerful against non-magical opponents, who often haven't got the defenses or psyche to resist magical attacks. That's just going by his standard spells without calling on entities, like when he called upon God to purge him of the vampiric curse he and his servant had been infected with.

Called upon God? -The- God? I've always seen it that Marvel is very careful not to blatantly imply the Judaeo-Christian God's existence/involvement in the Marvel Universe.

Oh yes, he called upon THE God, although admitted he could never handle the mix of forces involved again. While about the only time the mention him is for crazed villain types (the Crusader being the most evident of that list), they have done the occasional explicit acknowledgement of God's existance beyond that of crosses and jewish stars against undead.

Illuminator was a short-lived series attempt to have a young male with light-based powers to cover possible religious questions as to whether he was chosen by God and blessed with holy light. Firebird is heavily Christian (although as she told Hank Pym before their short-lived affair that she wasn't a nun right before they shared a hot kiss) and apparently immortal and immune to the most virulent poison, and after Eric Masterson/Thunderstrike died he was shown rejecting Vahalla telling Thor it wasn't his destiny, and as Odin told Thor it was wrong a beam of apparently divine light shown down in Vahalla and took him to his reward, with even Odin admitting he had no idea what lay beyond.

Eh, I'm not sure that's really a good idea on Marvel's part. Better to leave things mysterious imho.

They did leave it mysterious, and it was a good ending for a slain hero.

Since there is a subject on magic itself, I'm curious, how do you judges out there handle it when a player wishes to play a magic user in regards to generating thier stats? The Realms of Magic book talks about using the table from the basic set, but I personally have never liked that much as you can end up with some heavy hitting mages both in the physical regard and in the magic regard. On the flip side if you roll on table 2 or 3 you cannot have a mage that is truely "powerful" since you can only get excellent in psyche for the former and Rm for the latter.

My own comprimise is a variation on the Hi-Tech hero from the MSHAS. Roll on table 3, but they get a +2cs to thier Psyche allowing for up to an Am psyche.

I use a point based generation system because rolling winds up with characters thhat make no sense and you basicly don't want.

With Magic, i use magic as a base for the power rank, and each 'spell' is purchased as a power stunt in the beginning.

I just don't allow PC mages. Problem fixed, at least in my games. ;)

The problem with that is a PC mage will -never- obtain the number of powers that -any- of the NPC mages have, because it'd cost way too much to buy all the powers as power stunts.

Unless you have something else that you eventually allow the player of a PC mage to do...

Not really. I had a game where we used that model for a mystic and she was very dangerous within a much shorter amount of time than her contemporaries.

Also, in my creation system you can purchase power stunts, so if a mystic is chosen as a type of character, they don't have to start out as a naked babe in the woods.

You mean like a 1st level 2nd Ed D&D Wizard? ;)

"Well there's my Magic missile for the day. I'll just be over there hiding behind that rock until tomorrow".





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2007 11:17AM by Punstarr.

Sorentia Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Since there is a subject on magic itself, I'm
> curious, how do you judges out there handle it
> when a player wishes to play a magic user in
> regards to generating thier stats? The Realms of
> Magic book talks about using the table from the
> basic set, but I personally have never liked that
> much as you can end up with some heavy hitting
> mages both in the physical regard and in the magic
> regard. On the flip side if you roll on table 2
> or 3 you cannot have a mage that is truely
> "powerful" since you can only get excellent in
> psyche for the former and Rm for the latter.
>
> My own comprimise is a variation on the Hi-Tech
> hero from the MSHAS. Roll on table 3, but they
> get a +2cs to thier Psyche allowing for up to an
> Am psyche.


I do allow mages in my campaigns, but there are limits based on the adventure/group/etc. I also have my folks start off as begining heroes and allow them to advance normally. If they have the Karma *and* a story that makes sense they continue to grow. I'm pretty strict on the whole "because I want more power so give it to me" excuse.

But naked babes in the woods are so hot! :)

Nightmask Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But naked babes in the woods are so hot! :)

Amen to that!

*Makes a beeline to the Super heroine bust size thread* [www.classicmarvel.com]



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-verb (used without object)

2. Computer Slang. to send an angry, critical, or disparaging electronic message.
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3. Computer Slang. to insult or criticize angrily in an electronic message.
-Verb phrase

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BTW...I have them roll on table three. Sorry I skipped that..!

This is a good topic/point.

In my opinion...the potency of a mage's spells would rely on the following factors:
* size/distance of target
* resistances, powers, talents of target
* the spell's school of magic
* spell components
* complexity of spell
* mage's Psyche
* environment
* time constraints
* location of casting

In other words, more complex of a system that an RPG should have, heh.